Saturday, December 31, 2016

Milwaukee Police Chief Right: CCW Justifiable Shooting Increases Homicide Numbers

63rd and Euclid on 27 December, 2016
Image from

It was a dark and cold winter night on Tuesday, 27 December in Milwaukee, at 10 p.m. The sun had set more than three hours ago. There was no moon, but there was a cold breeze. The temperature held at 23 degrees. The blustery wind of the afternoon had dropped off. A 36-year-old Milwaukee resident was walking his dog in a secluded neighborhood. Street lights were far apart.

Two teenage criminals were in a car, cruising for trouble. They found it. The armed teens attempted to rob the man. He had a concealed carry permit, a handgun, and fought back. One of the teens was killed, the other, seriously wounded, fled in the car back to the scene of a previous shooting. From
Police say their preliminary investigation reveals Thomas was attempting to commit a robbery at the time of the shooting and was shot by the 36-year-old Milwaukee man who was being robbed -- who was out walking his dog on Tuesday night. That man is being questioned by investigators. He has not been arrested, and police say this case will be reviewed by the Milwaukee County District Attorney's Office in the coming days.

The man has a concealed carry permit.

Officials also say Thomas' co-actor, an 18-year-old Milwaukee man, was also shot during the altercation. He apparently went to the neighborhood near 24th and Ruby after the incident -- and has since been taken into custody.
Police Chief Ed Flynn, a transplant from Massachusetts and New Jersey, says a big part of the Milwaukee homicide problem is concealed carry permits.   From the
 “What we’re seeing are more guns on the streets,” the chief told USA TODAY NETWORK-Wisconsin. “I can tell you anecdotally we’re seeing a number of shootings involving concealed carry permit holders — many of whom have extensive criminal records — but I’m not allowed to tell you how many or whom, because the law has been carefully written to prevent analysis of that information.”
Chief Flynn conveniently leaves out the fact that only one Wisconsin concealed carry permit holder has been convicted of a homicide, and he was convicted of manslaughter by a jury. He pled self defense. I am certain that if any other unjustified homicides had been committed by concealed carry permit holders, the information would have been leaked to the media.

But Wisconsin concealed carry permit holders are incredibly law abiding, like the permit holders in other states. The statistics show that CCW holders are more law abiding than police officers.

Milwaukee homicides may break the record set in 1993 this year. There were 160 homicides that year. The rest of Wisconsin typically has 37 homicides in a year.  Milwaukee seems to be on track to do so. We won't know until the end of the year.  There were a number of self defense shootings in Milwaukee this year. They are included in the unofficial site totals.

Chief Ed Flynn has said that another problem with minority neighborhoods in urban centers, is that they do not trust the police.
In “disadvantaged communities of color,” he noted, “crime has not gone down. It’s gone down in some place called America. But in those neighborhoods, there’s easy access to firearms… and there are extraordinary rates of homicide. Nationally, African Americans represent 51 percent of homicide victims. In our cities it’s more like 80 percent.

“It’s an urban tragedy. But the heart of the police dilemma is those neighborhoods that demand our services, need us the most, request us the most, depend upon us us the most, for social or historical reasons, distrust us, and… we can’t protect them effectively if we’re not trusted.
Chief Flynn is right about the problem being a lack of "trust of the police". You do not prove to people that you trust them by disarming them. From Machiavelli: From "The Prince":
There is no comparison whatever between an armed and disarmed man; it is not reasonable to suppose that one who is armed will obey willingly one who is unarmed; or that any unarmed man will remain safe.... - Niccol├│ Machiavelli, The Prince. 1537.
You do not foster trust of the police by claiming they are racist monsters who are looking for chances to gun down innocent black men. That meme has been implicitly pushed by President Obama and the establishment media with the whole "Black Lives Matter" propaganda. It is what has caused the Ferguson Effect, where police, repeatedly attacked by the media and "progressives", (but I repeat myself) pull back from violent neighborhoods. In those neighborhoods, the murder rate has skyrocketed.

Milwaukee Chief Flynn seems to prefer that the innocent 36-Year-Old Milwaukee resident be a good little victim, and submit to whatever the teen criminals demand of him. The good citizens of Milwaukee disagree. In a quick review of the 80 comments at the article reporting the shooting, I could not find one that agreed with that view.  This one was typical:
They got what they had coming to them. Good job to the robbery victim. This is why i am for carrying

©2016 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice and link are included.

Link to Gun Watch


Anonymous said...

The whole point of being armed is to stop crime when the police are no where around to stop it for you. crime rate will go down when it becomes evident that criminals careers can be stopped even if the police are no where to be seen. for a while we may need more coroners than cops. I think street crime is probably the largest category of crimes. citizens are making the streets safe by carrying. eventually street crime will be very low. the police will need to thank the public. and it saves the cost of expensive trials for a slap on the hand. One effective way to bring down taxes. burying the bad guys is much cheaper than those trials and years of incarceration. Street punks think they are bad, until they come up against an armed civilian that is a good shot. warning shots only convince the punks that you are a bad shot. when you have to pull the trigger hit something. If they are armed shoot to kill. when you see a female dink blazing away with an AK 47 it is easy to forget gender or age. shoot to kill stops them from getting off a lucky last shot. we can't have grenades so take your time and shoot fast when there is more than one attacker. Remember squeeze the trigger to stay on target.

Old Kentucky Guy said...

Am I reading this wrong?

----the chief told USA TODAY NETWORK-Wisconsin. “I can tell you anecdotally we’re seeing a number of shootings involving concealed carry permit holders — many of whom have extensive criminal records----

Does he really mean to say that many carry permit holders have extensive criminal records? CCDW permits are not issued to people with "extensive criminal records"

Dean Weingarten said...

He is saying that some people who have more than one misdemeanor "have extensive criminal records". There is one case that I know of in Wisconsin where a gang member kept a pretty clean record so he could have a CCW permit and facilitate access to guns by other gang members.

He was caught and convicted of supplying guns to felons, and lost his ability to have a CCW.

There will always be a few criminals smart enough to work around the system; but it does not justify denying a right to the vast majority.

We see just the opposite. The more that carry, the more crime goes down.

Anonymous said...

Wisconsin is open carry without a permit.
ANY validity to the "criminal records" claim likely comes from mixing open carry with concealed carry permit holders. Otherwise, well, it is just more LYING from the gun grabbers who have to LIE because telling the truth means making our case, not theirs.

Anonymous said...

Naw what you are reading in that USA Today article is what they want the public to think. did you see any of them challenge him on those remarks? He is probably just another gun grabbing lying puke. I have never heard of any one with an extensive criminal record getting a CCW.

ATF form 4473 I believe it is question 17 "have you ever been convicted of a felony or a misdemeanor" federal law only requires no felony convictions. ATF has no authority to add misdemeanors. but a yes answer prevents you from buying a gun or getting a permit.